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DR. Oluwafolajimi Akeem Bello, chairman, Nigerians in Diaspora Electoral Reform Group and enstranged husband of Senator Iyabo Obasanjo – Bello, was in Nigeria, last week, during which he visited his wife, the senator, while in detention at Maitama Police Station on the order of an Abuja High Court.
In this interview, Bello speaks on a number of issues particularly the struggle by his group based abroad to make Nigerians in dispora exercise their rights as citizens and partake in voting during general elections irrespective of where they live. He also spoke on his relationship with his wife, Iyabo.
WHAT is Nigerian Dispora Electoral Group all about and why did the group take INEC to court?
There are over 20million Nigerians scattered all over the world who are craving to take part in what goes on in their country especially as regards the processes leading to the election of the leadership of this nation and its economic roadmap. Of the 206 nations in the world, 115 has what is called external voting.
From Togo to Republic of Benin, Niger, Algeria, South Africa, to mention a few, they believe in the rights of their citizens outside to have a stake in governance of their nation. So, we are willing to give you the facts based on court written agreements for and against this initiative. We are also open for discussion, global discussion with the intention of getting both positive and negative responses. The question to ask is, are Nigerians willing to secure their rights to attain the inelianable rights of not only themselves but their children and generations yet unborn from anywhere in the world?
Conservative
estimate
We want a situation where fellow citizens of Nigeria will understand that Nigerians abroad remit up to $20 billion into this economy annually. Officially, statements have been made by the World Bank disclosing that up to $11 billion is remitted, but when I am coming to Nigeria, for instance, just like a lot of other people, you bring in up to $9,000, you don’t need to declare that. Unofficially, when somebody is coming, he says, ‘take this to my father, take this to my mother or my brother.’
Unofficially, it is almost about five times what the official would be if you look at the trend of things. So, a conservative estimate is what I gave when I said $20 billion which is almost parallel to the budget of the Federal Republic of Nigeria. Now, why should these Nigerians not have the right to exercise their rights to have a direct stake in the governance of this nation?
Whatever I say today, it is a gratitude explicitly expressed to the foresight of one of the leaders that Nigerians had the privilege of having and that is former President Ibrahim Badamasi Babangida for his foresight to have allowed during his rule that people with dual citizenship but have their natural birth place as Nigeria can have or do not lose their birth place of origin which is Nigeria, independent of how many citizenship they acquire.
I want to use this opportunity speaking for millions of Nigerians all over the world to thank the media for all their support in this fight for our right to vote. We also want to thank the man that handed over the current constitution that we are using to the civilians who we all know as General Abdusalam Abubakar that he allowed that foresight of General Babangida to be included in the constitution. There is nothing in our constitution that we know that prevents Nigerians abroad from having the right to register and vote.
Our electoral process is about to undergo reforms. Has your group reached out to the electoral reform committee with a view to addressing this anomally?
No, because going to the electoral reform committee without a court judgment in a case we instituted is like a dog that barks without a teeth to bite. We are very serious people and we pray, God’s willing with a favourable judgment, the electoral reform will have something to now say is compelling, it is important that there is an implementation and mechanism set forth to achieve that objective. Parties to the suit include 20 Nigerian groups scattered all over the world representing the over 20million Nigerians in the diaspora.
The defendants are INEC and the attorney general representing the Federal Government.
On issue of locus standi, Femi Falana is our lawyer, our intention is to make this awareness known all over the world. We want to achieve that without stepping on the toes of anybody. I am also a trustee of All Nigerian American Congress. In addition, we have as our members people like Prof. Mobolaji Aluko, a professor with Havard University, Dr. Baba Adamu of PONOCO, who was actually consulted to be the special adviser on education to former President Olusegun Obasanjo. So you can see the dynamics of the group in this class action law suit.
It is not party based, it is not ethnic trading, its from our people scattered all over the world; people in UK, Canada, US, Middle East and people of different political parties. I happen to be a vice presidential candidate of the New Democrats (ND), we also have the chairman of the party of this class action law suit as well as others from across party lines.
What electoral model are you looking at as a group and knowing the problem of elections in Nigeria where we hardly have free and fair elections, how feasible will this model be?
It is amazing you are asking this question. The word ‘feasible’ reminds me of the time this lovely country was about to secure independence and some people said, how can a blackman govern himself? They said we needed to allow the Europeans to continue. Today, we live in a global world where we can have breakfast in one continent, lunch in another continent and dinner in another one within 24 hours.
We live in a global world where if you are leaving Singapore, for instance, and you want somebody to pick you up in United States, where I am also a citizen, you will tell that person,‘ I am leaving on Friday, my brother pick me up on Thursday by 4p.m.’ and you are living on Friday from Singapore. Why am I making this point; lets take the situation of traveling to make a point of feasibility where you have enough intellect of Nigerians scattered all over the world, where at one point in time you cannot even get a fair judgment from our legal system but now you can; where at one time when you see a woman that is reknown, you can mention that this is the first lady that secured P.h.D.
If we do not include Nigerians all over the world to have a stake in the governance, It will lead to creating more hindrances to the development of this nation than taking it forward like other eminent progressive nations in the world that we want to be like, that we have adopted their political or governance structure e.g. the US, South Africa, UK, e.t.c
As a Nigerian in diaspora and also a citizen of the US, how do you rate one of your colleagues, Prof. Maurice Iwu, who conducted what is generally believed to be one of the most flawed and disputable elections in Nigeria’s history?
Don’t let me make any comment, personal or official, about one individual. Let me use this opportunity to say that the cause we are fighting is for Nigerians to see that there is an alternative from the outside to the development and governance of this country by Nigerians who have a stake and are willing to do so. I want us to see it that way, not one individual or two individuals but millions of people. And I am saying this very seriously. Nigeria attained independence in 1960, became a republic in 1963, the military as a clique, a group of people have governed this country more times, more than half of the period it has attained independence.
Do you know that an alternative can be Nigerians living all over the world, with multi-facet knowledge as to how things work, that if they are even caught making a mistake will have the dignity and honour to resign? Because we should know better and give honour back to our community so that people don’t see us as Mr. And Mrs. Do or Die, rather we are Mr. And Mrs. Betterment, looking for solution for others to emulate.
With deep seated corruption, decay in infrastructure and poor technological know-how, how do you think we can organize elections and 20 million Nigerians in diaspora would vote? Why not go through the National Assembly instead of the court?
Let me explain this by using the example of the Freedom of Information Bill. It has gone to the National Assembly at least three times and it has been rejected or thrown out. As a group, we have tried and the records will show that we have gone to the National Assembly a number of times presenting bills of various dimension. It is like looking for a rabbit and every time you go through one hole, it never materializes that you catch that particular rabbit. So you re-invent yourself. Fortunately, we are privileged and honoured to have a president, Musa Yar’Adua. Of his 7-point agenda, I don’t know how God put it into his mouth, the man said rule of law.
There are three parallel arms or institutions in this nation. There is the executive, the judiciary and the legislature and we are not totally dumb; so we came up and,‘ look’ if the executive says rule of law, that means they will implement what the judiciary says because nobody is above the law.’
So we designed our strategy and fortunately the courts, the first thing they did was to validate the fact that they have jurisdiction to hear the case, they came back to say yes it is valid, the judiciary can listen to this case. We were able to scale through that hurdle. They then said ‘we don’t want grammar, we want written argument so that tomorrow people can come back and say this is how and why we made this legitimate decision’.
On the reform question, I want to say we will not be duplicating efforts by the grace of God when we are favoured in this case which is really a favour for 140 million Nigerians. We live in a technological age and each day it looks like there is an enhancement in our democracy. Our democracy seems to be building up. From worst, maybe to better. I am not talking about the rigging strategy mind you.
But it is like we have an intention to make Nigerians better. According to Prof. Iwu, he had return close to $40million that was grants from the international community and foreign donors. It means the international community means well for Nigeria and want things done properly. Having received these favours and blessings, it behoves on us and INEC to use them judiciously to achieve the best, transparent, accountable way of bringing in governance. Let me say something out of anger.
Electing a
leader
Only in Nigeria do I know that a group of people will sit down and say we elect a leader and only in Nigeria do I know that familiarization tour of leaders are done after they become presidents. Where I am a citizen of, USA, the president, before he is elected, will do a familiarization tour. He will visit and eat with disabled people, less privileged people, common workers for at least a year. He will know them by name. He will demonstrate his ability and his inability to perform if entrusted into the position. Look, there are about 140 million Nigerians. They have a stake and they should have a stake in the state Nigeria which includes their rights to elect who becomes their leader.
What is the true situation of your marital relationship with Sen. Iyabo Obasanjo? Is she still your wife?
Let me answer that question this way: The tongue and the teeth, sometime they fight and Yoruba people say that somebody that has a child for you, you can never forget that person or write away that person from your life because nobody knows tomorrow, only God does. Some of us have very sensitive skin to insults especially when people insinuate that you are nobody and then you become somebody.
May God forgive me for my sins, there are tendencies that immaturity can come out of me. In essence, I could say I am responsible for all these mess that is happening concerning Iyabo because if I had been very cool headed, tolerant, I could have been a better crown that could guide her in a way because there is nothing she, and I call her “Ashabi”, would or have achieved now that she could not have achieved if I had been around. This is not the right time for me to speak more than what I am saying but rather we all need to pray for her that God should give her the strenght to weather the storm. There is no one that will not experience trial and tribulations or tough times in his life. But may God not bring us tough times that we cannot survive.
Iyabo is a very, very compassionate person for people that could take time to really understand who she is as a person and we also have to understand that she is the first child which reminds me of what a respected friend of mine said. The friend said, ‘look, there are so many people, at least ten, from your wife’s side, ten from the husband’s side,15 from your village, another 20 from the wife’s village that would be depending on you to feed them’. It is possible those errors can make some of us including myself commit errors. So we are not all immune from making mistakes. I will say three things.
One, if we all take time to read the Bible and go to John chapter 8 where the Pharisees brought a lady and said she has committed adultery and Jesus Christ himself said to them, ‘if anyone of us here is without sin, let him cast the first stone’. One after the other, the accusers left and he said to this woman, where are your accusers? The other passage I will talk about is Psalm chapter 6 verse 15 which talks elaborately about the character of morals of people of Christ.
You should not take bribe, you should be righteous, you should not backbite, you should be transparent in what you do, you should be respectful. All those things can guide each one of us as to how we live a Christian life. I am emphasizing on this because nobody is perfect and nobody lives without sin. I am the chairman of the Sin Committee. Lets just keep things so that God will continue to bless us and guide us in all our endeavours.
When Iyabo was detained, did you visit her in Maitama Police Station?
Yes I did. I was with ‘Ashabi’ on Tuesday. The reception was fine and like you asked, why would she be surprised to see me? We talked, I still saw her on 5 April. She was actually planning to come to her father-in-law’s second year remembrance, that is my father, on the 19th in Ibadan. She said I should tell her and I was in court with her today (Wednesday). I am from a family where we know the value of the saying that nobody knows tomorrow. So Ashabi is not my enemy. What we talked about, if I tell you, you wont believe it. I prayed with her and I know some of the things I said with her I actually said in this interview.
Handing
over power
This will also pass and if you think about the fact that her father, a lot of people had already thought he could not become president when he was in incarceration. Now he is the only person that I know that has handed over power to at least two governments. So Iyabo, in my opinion, is a very, very blessed woman. And God loves her very much. I know one thing, anybody that God loves, all of a sudden, you will see God’s hand on that person, either to correct some anomalies or to polish that gold, so that gold can shine, and build up significance when glowing.
Iyabo once said her travails are an attempt to get her father through her. What do you say to this? Also there are insinuations that her father, former President Obasanjo, was the problem in her marriage. Can you confirm or debunk this?
My name is Honourable Oluwafolajimi Akeem Bello. Her father’s name is Chief Matthew Olusegun Okikiola Aremu Obasanjo. I am a dual citizen of Nigeria and the United States. Baba is in Ota. Please make an appointment to interview him and say this is the insinuation and this is the response I gave to you and hopefully you will get his answer.
When you saw Iyabo, did you notice any sign of maturity or newness from the Ashabi you were used to?
Haba, we all change now. Look, my hair is not as long as it used to be. My fingernails were a little bit long yesterday until I cut it. So we all change. I mean you can always figure out if there are any changes. We all mature and we all see things differently. I mean if we conduct this interview tomorrow, I will not start with the same sentence like the one I am starting now. So we all change and l pray we all change for the better.
When the EFCC was looking for Iyabo, if you were around what would you have advised Iyabo to do?
Look, Iyabo, Oluwafolajimi Akeem Bello, Dr. Braimah my friend and all of us here in this office, believe me, I am not saying this out of disrespect, we are not significant enough, in particular myself, as a propeller that can turn the ship of this country anywhere. Don’t let us go on dragging issues not bigger than Kilimanjaro. Let us look at what can benefit this nation. Do you know that over 70% of the 140 million Nigerians live on less than one dollar a day.
That is about 100 million people that could not eat one square meal in a day. How could we make a change, how could we create a collaborative effort and partnership and stake between the 20 million Nigerians that are well to do, that have left this nation, that make more than one dollar a day to form an economic partnership with the remaining millions in Nigeria so that we can have a better future for our children and our children’s children?
How can Nigeria give that leverage of creating a stake with its children outside to now become a nation like Israel that are just 7 million or so but that there is nothing in this world that when the Jewish people have a stake in it, it becomes the order of the day and they are just 7 million people? It is because the Jews are scattered all over the world and they have a stake in the development of their nation.
Why don’t we focus on that where Nigeria can become this president of the Security Council of the United Nations, where Nigerians can become or lead the African Union, where whenever we want to make influence, those Nigerians that have stake, that are outside, can be the ones that will lobby for us to achieve that? That’s what we should focus on.
You were at one time accused of being a gold digger, that you collected contracts using your connection with former President Obasanjo.
Thank you, you mention the word gold digger. Now l ask you, is there any gold in Ota or Abeokuta, or in Ogun State or in the Villa? Okay, let me play a devil’s advocate without sounding defensive. Let’s say there are contracts and I apply for them; am I not qualified to apply for them? Did anybody come to you and say Akeem took money from me and mis-represented a contract with me or influence anything?
No. Look, let me tell you one thing, even Jesus Christ that I have mentioned earlier, they still saw something wrong in him. Otherwise they would not have crucified him. So who am I, me that is nothing, to now say somebody should not say equally that I do not have blemish? Infact when you claim or say a president of a nation is talking about an insignificant element like me, I am flattered. I don’t know where you get your facts from but I am not without blemish. You have not presented any facts.
Are you proud to be the son-in-law of Obasanjo after all the revelations of the problems he caused this country in 8 years?
Let me share something that I know. Before 1999, I know that everytime I travel anywhere in the world, there is this huge sign in all international airports that says Nigeria is dangerous, Nigeria is a place you should not go, Nigeria I think is a terrorist state. Lately, for the past four years or so, I have not seen those things at the international airports. Eight years ago, the debt of Nigeria was over $32 billion. If I am not mistaken, we are almost without debt right now. People will say who am I to be saying all these things with all the crisis that are going on or evaluation of Baba? We had a transition of government that never happened from one civilian government to the other.
Look, I have never seen a nation as blessed as that of Nigeria where the second man in command, with resources, with constitutional baking, with network and contact, wants to become a president of the Federal Republic of Nigeria and, for whatever reasons, he was not allowed and we are in peace. God loves this nation. Why am I saying that? This (OBJ tribulations) shall pass, for the eyes and anointing of God and the prayers of all these religious groups, fasting, and praying will not go in vain in terms of the peace and progress that will happen to this country.
We all have our faults and, by the grace of God, Baba will also weather this storm, where ever it is coming from so that other leaders can emulate. But nobody should forget that this man made some contributions to the betterment of this nation and if we can focus our attention towards some of those contributions, we would probably see the better side of him than the less privileged or imperfect side that we all see.
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